Desolate Carnage
 
Elitist Jerks
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#633453 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 07:41:05
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This is the sort of horse cock that I am expected to read and figure out what the fuck I am doing?

FUCK

Quote (Darkside)
Okay, I've attached an image of the math required to determine the stat-weighting for weapon damage. I'll attempt to explain what I'm doing as best I can.

First off, some variables:
CODE
d is the total damage done by an attack
P is the percent of weapon damage that applies to an attack (i.e. SS has 40% weapon damage)
D is the average damage of your weapon
AP is attack power
X is the bonus damage an attack gets (i.e. SS gets 318 bonus damage)
c is crit chance
m is crit multiplier (generally 1, but can be changed with talents/metagems)


Line (1) is the generalized equation for how much damage any one instant strike will do. You'll notice that I have left off disease multipliers, armor reduction and many other debuffs that affect the total damage done by an attack. As it turns out, these are irrelevant since they are all applied after a strikes "base" damage has been calculated.
Line (2) is an equation for the damage of an attack after we have increased the weapon damage by some value delta_D. The increased damage is here labeled as delta_d.
Line (3) is an equation for the damage of an attack after we have increased our attack power by some value delta_AP. The increased damage is again labeled as delta_d.
Lines (4) and (5) give us the value for delta_d as a function of either delta_D or delta_AP.
Line (6): Here we equate the two equations in order to determine the value of delta_D in terms of delta_AP.
Line (7) gives delta_D as a function of delta_AP. That is to say, we can enter a value for delta_AP and get the equivalent increase in delta_D.
Line (8) is the result of setting delta_D equal to one; we see that you can solve the equation for a value of 4.24 AP.

Now what does this mean? This means that for any given weapon strike, an increase in average weapon damage by 1 is the same thing as increasing your attack power by 4.24. 4.24 is, therefore, the stat weighting for weapon damage. Our story does not end there, though. This value of 4.24 assumes that all of your damage comes from instant strikes, which we know not to be true. We must therefore take the 4.24 and multiply it by the percentage of our total damage that is the result of instant attacks. This percentage will differ from player to player and from fight to fight and is therefore not set in stone; you'll have to determine thee value that is unique to you.

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edit:



All stats actually see this set of "diminishing returns", it's just not as apparent with some as it is others. For instance, since we normalize everything to attack power, you don't notice that the value of AP decreases the more you have of it. This change is instead reflected in the increase in the value of other stats like crit or haste. ArPen is unique in that it actually sees increasing returns the more you stack, but that's a result of how Armor reductions are calculated, not stat weights. Furthermore, there is nothing at all unpredictable about these diminishing returns, they can all be easily calculated using similar methods to the one I just demonstrated here.
 
#633470 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 11:51:45
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1 weapon dmg = 4.24 AP
or, 4.24 AP = 1 weapon dmg


but since you use only 1/3 of your attacks are strikes (no idea, be smart and figure that out), 4.24 x 1/3. that would be how much Ap = 1 damage, full rotation taken into account. the end says there is diminishing returns when compared to other state. thats OFC. ARP escelates in value until 100% then its worth near zero (it still has some value due to being under 100% when trinket is not procced).


thats p easy YO
 
#633493 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 12:56:54
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Quote (blind_chief @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 11:51:45)
1 weapon dmg = 4.24 AP
or, 4.24 AP = 1 weapon dmg


but since you use only 1/3 of your attacks are strikes (no idea, be smart and figure that out), 4.24 x 1/3.  that would be how much Ap = 1 damage, full rotation taken into account.  the end says there is diminishing returns when compared to other state.  thats OFC.  ARP escelates in value until 100% then its worth near zero (it still has some value due to being under 100% when trinket is not procced).


thats p easy YO


I have no fucking idea what you just said, nor do I know what weapon damage means.

A 2-4 listed damage on a weapon is worth 8.48 - 16.96 Attack Power?

I just want to know what fucking weapon to go for.

This is why I will not be a top dog.
 
#633498 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:08:32
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its how ap calculates into real dmg on a strike. but then since strikes are not 100% of your attacks you need to proportionate that number.
 
#633499 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:12:36
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what dont you get

sample comparison
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=45516 = 920.6 average weapon damage
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42319 = 880.5 weapon damage

speed is the same
ignoring strength
sockets are the same
voldrethar = +130 strength, +12 crit, +69 Arp
relentless = +271 AP

the post says DKs normalize everything into attack power equivalence, so you would convert 130str/12crit/69arp to attack power equivalence (you can proalbey find it near that same post)

the difference in average weapon damage between the two is 40.1
multipled by the 4.24 that guy got = 170 AP

so to determine which of those two weapons is better for strictly instant weapon strikes
130str/12crit/69arp -> attack power equivalent
vs
441 attack power
 
#633500 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:14:01
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what thread is this from anyway
 
#633509 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:40:08
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Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:14:01)
what thread is this from anyway


Unholy thread
 
#633510 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:45:26
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Quote (MoS. @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:40:08)
Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:14:01)
what thread is this from anyway


Unholy thread


the 3.3 one??


Gearing wise, a lot will change for many, many reasons. Stat weights should be roughly as follow:AttackPower 1
Strength 3.05
Agility 1.63
CritRating 2.31
HasteRating 1.53
ArmorPenetrationRating 1.88
ExpertiseRating 2.55
BeforeMeleeHitCap<8% 3.6
SpellHitRating 1.01
WeaponDPS 6.92
 
#633519 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 14:19:46
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Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:45:26)
Quote (MoS. @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:40:08)
Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:14:01)
what thread is this from anyway


Unholy thread


the 3.3 one??


Gearing wise, a lot will change for many, many reasons. Stat weights should be roughly as follow:AttackPower 1
Strength 3.05
Agility 1.63
CritRating 2.31
HasteRating 1.53
ArmorPenetrationRating 1.88
ExpertiseRating 2.55
BeforeMeleeHitCap<8% 3.6
SpellHitRating 1.01
WeaponDPS 6.92


Yeah, that's the only box that I care about.

I was just commenting on the gibberish math major bullshit.
 
#633520 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 14:23:39
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I find it interesting that:

Set Bonus EP values are as follow:
2T9 121.54
4T9 412.31
2T10 372.31
4T10 412.31

As stated previously, between the nerf of 4P T9 and the strength of 2PT10, there's no question that we'll immediately drop the former for the latter, as the ilvl gap between the two sets will easily cover the ~40 AP gap.

If both have the same EP values, does the increased iLvl stats make it the reason why you immediately switch? I would imagine if the 4T9 was not being nerfed (Blood Plague or Frost Fever, one of the diseases, not sure which, can no longer crit), that we would keep it over the 4T10.
 
#633557 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 14:58:33
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Quote (MoS. @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 14:19:46)
Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:45:26)
Quote (MoS. @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:40:08)
Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:14:01)
what thread is this from anyway


Unholy thread


the 3.3 one??


Gearing wise, a lot will change for many, many reasons. Stat weights should be roughly as follow:AttackPower 1
Strength 3.05
Agility 1.63
CritRating 2.31
HasteRating 1.53
ArmorPenetrationRating 1.88
ExpertiseRating 2.55
BeforeMeleeHitCap<8% 3.6
SpellHitRating 1.01
WeaponDPS 6.92


Yeah, that's the only box that I care about.

I was just commenting on the gibberish math major bullshit.


that was nothing more complex than simple algebra
 
#633566 | Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 15:01:42
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Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 14:58:33)
Quote (MoS. @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 14:19:46)
Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:45:26)
Quote (MoS. @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:40:08)
Quote (randomtask @ Sun - Nov 15 2009 - 13:14:01)
what thread is this from anyway


Unholy thread


the 3.3 one??


Gearing wise, a lot will change for many, many reasons. Stat weights should be roughly as follow:AttackPower 1
Strength 3.05
Agility 1.63
CritRating 2.31
HasteRating 1.53
ArmorPenetrationRating 1.88
ExpertiseRating 2.55
BeforeMeleeHitCap<8% 3.6
SpellHitRating 1.01
WeaponDPS 6.92


Yeah, that's the only box that I care about.

I was just commenting on the gibberish math major bullshit.


that was nothing more complex than simple algebra


TOO MANY FUCKING SYMBOLS
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